B2B Revenue Acceleration
B2B Revenue Acceleration

Episode · 11 months ago

92: Revenue Generation X Brand Building w/ Efrat Fenigson

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

Deciding whether to focus on revenue generation or on brand building can feel like the two halves of the brain being at war.

The truth is that organizations need to nurture both building their brand and generating revenue at the same time. But how?

In this episode, we interview Efrat Fenigson, VP Marketing at Mindspace and Co-founder at G-CMO, about revenue generation versus brand building.

We talked about the left side & right side of the brain, actionable strategies for sales & marketing alignment, and the case for building brand.

Check out this resource we mentioned during the podcast the G-CMO podcast is Marketers In Capes and G-CMO has even more podcast resources.

To hear this interview and many more like it, subscribe to The B2B Revenue Acceleration Podcast on Apple Podcasts, on Spotify, or on our website.

You are listening to Bto B RevenueAcceleration, a podcast, dedicated elping software executives stay on thecutting edge of sales and marketing in their industry. Let's get into the show. I welcome to Beto be a revenueacceleration. My name is Oeliam withy and I'm here today with Efront Fedigsonzp marketing at mine, space and COFANDOA GCMO ow. Are you doing today,efrant a'MD, very weld? Thank you. How are you yeah great great great great,so our discussion today will be around revenue generation, tesus brandbuilding. Alright, so I'll do see you and S. Fos are going after marketingpeople with a steak and say you spetting so much money brenbilding. Whyis my money back, but but iffere we go to the conversation. Would you man justintroducing yourself for Augence Explainin, maybe a little bit moreabout mind space, but also your organization or your group, GCMO andand wher you creakit, absolutely so, I'm based at out of Israel right nowtalking to you from killobe and I've been around tick and marketing for thepast twenty years, and I started as a computer software engineer and movedslowly to business and marketing. I've worked in many tick companies and ranmarketing organizations and various types of startups or largerorganizations. I have GCMO, which Wi will discuss in a moment which is acommunity of Israel's top one hundred CMOS from global companies of G STANSfor Global, and I have a video cast and a podcast which I run with a friend andwe talk about marketing and Strategis, and he brusets for these radingaudience and I'm an advocate for personal branding. Personal brandingfor me is a passion and I have a community on facebook for four sandpeople and we talke about personal branding a lot and I leced hure aboutit too, and at mine space, I'm the VIP of marketing. I joined the company inthe beginning of the year so couple of months before corona, TAK, so very tats,Lik e De veryvery, smooth sailing into th and buying space is a global companywith dirty offices, a thirty branches around Europe and the US. We havesixteen cities that were located in. In Germany, for example, we have eightoffices in the Netherlands and the UK in Romania, in polend and in the US.Basically, we provide flexible spaces for companies of Oll sizes, whetheryouare start up or a large enterprise. We provide different types of flexibleoffices, whether it's a small sweet, a small office or private suit, or awhole floor for a company. We also have some casual spaces for meetings oraccordings or event. Paces and Min Tiz is a very unique company, because theemphasis is strongly on our customer service, which is very high in itsstandards and also our design and art which were advocates for and eachlocation is beautifully designed very differently from one another, and alsovery, very much adapted to the city that we're in so we're not in theKOOKIE cutter approach. Each location is totally different and I love thatcompany because it has such unique brand and values, and we will talkabout that more because that's the that's the CISSION, so there's thesession yeah, I'M UST sad of I've seen the the lookof your Mos misoffice and it looks really really good. You know you got tosay the funeachn everything wil be jealous. I'm trying to pick upsomebodes from my own liaving room now yeah. I looks really good so fat. We know thatfinding the right balance between Bran building and Riverio generatingactivities in marketing is kind of a common challenge and seems to be facedby many be to be market over the word. Yeah. Do you relate to that first andwhere do you think? What do you think the right ballate is between those thebuilding, the braind and the more longe...

...non rever generating as such in theshorterm activities? Nosus the generation Oh yeah, so I totally relateto that and I think that each marketing department probably has that phenomenaof pleating it itself to the left side of the brain and the right side of thebrain. That's how I like to look at it and I think that, on the left side ofthe brain, we're looking at demand generation, legeneration things thatare in shorter cycles and will allow us to create revenue in a shorter pace. Wewill be very much driven by acquisition and creating revenue. Our view will bemore short termview and we will do a lot of paid an Gerilla and and shortterm compaigns to satisfy this left side of the brain and then on. Theright side of the brain will take care of our brand identity and reputationwill look at organic tools and tactics like content. Marketing like pr likebrand campaigns and our main go, would be to generate awareness and BHE top ofmind with our audiences and and have our audience identify with thepersonality of our brand, and I think that it's a very long term process andthe results are seen with time and it takes time to see them. But I thinkthat when that right side of the brain is properly in placed it definitelycompliments the lift side of the brain and allows it to function in a lot T ina much better way. So I definitely relate with that statement and I thinkthat, in order to have a good operating marketing machine in your organization,you should nurture both these lift side and right side of the brain. I thinkyoung startups I've been working with a lot of starts in my career, and I thinkthat young startuvs pit more emphasis on the lift side of the brain andthey're going for okay. How can we acquire new customers, new investors D,and what do we need to do in order to generate that demand? Which is veryimportant? No doubt- and it needs to be there, but they neglect, I think, theright side of the brain, an and that's something that I would say for youngerstartups if they can start thinking of who they are what's the identity oftheir company, what kind of messages, what kind of values they want to conveyto their audiences that from a very early stage, that would help theirtarget audience to connect with their companying the much stronger way andwill allow them to do their core lift side of the brain work in a much moreefficient way. Yeah. That makes sense. That makes perfect sense and we knowthat marketing marketing in genor can provis value in generating revenue ifthere is no cruisal egnment with sense. Okay, so old, you get that truecollaboration between marketing and SES particularin when it comes to somethinglike Brandin, where you know, brending may sounds probably more on the saithside of the conversationer. But branding may sounds like that: Nicefluffy activity, maybe for Sevic guy and Nhot truaely. What well get UScommissioned at the end of the Mount so to question? How do you manage that thelagement and Ow d you Get Tup by it? How do you get there by and how Oyoumanment absolutely great great questions? I think it's alsosuperrelevant right now when we're in this economical crisis time andcompanies are way more sales driven than they were before, becauseeveryonee got hit in some way in this prisis. So I think that the pressure ina way is put more on marketing right now to justify the budgets to justifythe positions to justify the head counts, and if marketing teams will notbe sales oriented, I think it would be a great challenge for them so now rhavever. I think that this question is so relevant, because if you don't createthat alignment with sales, you are in a...

...problem and yeas that cffo and that Crof the organization. How do you make them your partners and how do you alignwith them in a way that, when you ask for that budget for brand buildingthey'll be bught in, and so I think the first thing I'd say about that iscommunication. First of all, internal communication in the company educatingthe company- and I'm not just talking about the sat ro in the Cro, but I'mtalking about all your sales riks or your field representatives. Whatevertheir positions are, whether their customer service or maintenousewhatever it is, they need to be bought in to the concept of okay. We generatebusiness and we bring revenue, but we also help this company be who it isyeah and what it stands for and once they feel that the identity of thecompany is quite clear and the messaging is clear for them and thekind of brand work and brand campaigns that we generate make them feel proud.It helps themsell and helps them do their work better right, and so, ifthey understand that that right side of the brain that brand building war iswork, that is essentially helping sales, then they will support it. So it startswith education and communication, and I do a lot of internal communicationinside the company. To always- and I encourage my cot, my team- to do thesame- to always communicate first internally about stuff that we're doinglet the other employees know what's coming out in one day or in two daysand then launch it, and then they see, and then we talk to them about it. Sothey're always like part of our work and their experiencing our work as partof the companies work. Now on a more tactical stage, we as marketing, webuild our goals right up from the sales goals, so my goals for my team are theclosed one opportunities of sales. They don't get goals from me for sqls or youknow, mqls. They get goals from me on how many sales, how many work stationshave we solved in our spaces, because those are the sales gols and when themarketing team and the sales teams are aligned on the same goals, it's mucheasier to drive to the same place. So even people on my marketing team thathave brand related positions, they know that, ultimately, their work issupposed to drive sales, even if they're, measured on other things likethey're, measured on, for example, engagement or traffic or whatever,because they're doing brand stuff. They know that in the end of the day, thegoal of organic traffic is to see how many one deals we got out of organictraffic. You know what I mean I say not. I may not give them the bonus based onthat, but they know that in the end of the day, that's what we're looking atow. The other thing is that I align my team on the sales goals, all the timeso quarterly or every six months, every twelve months. They know what the salesteams goals are, and they know as a result of that, what our goals Aare. Sothere's constantly discussions about that. There's also some small stuffthat I do to just keep it in existence all the time. For example, I have adaily sale force report that is being sent to the whole marketing team tolook at a table with all the deals that we've signed in the previous day. Sothey see in which location it was what we solve, how much it was sold forwho's the customer, and it keeps them much closer to the field to what we'reactually selling Im. What we're actually doing now, you would say youwould argue, but that sales work right like why would they care because theystarted it like? I have the livid source there and I have you know whenit started in whiach location, so they can feel proud that their work isactually contributing to the bottom...

...line of the company and they all get itevery morning now, as a result of that, the management team also was so excitedabout this report that they also aske to get it. So the whole management teamis now seeing this report every morning and my marketing team, that's anothersmall thing that I do. The other thing is. I constantly show our workinternally, so whenever we succeed with something or we launch a very nicecampaign, I make a point of communicating that by email do to thewhole company and by a slag and then obviously, social, media etc. Sothey're constantly seeing our work. It's not like. I would be verysurprised if someone came to me or one of my team members and say what is thisthing you're working on? Why didn't anyone tell us like everything? We havevery high level of visibility, so there are no surprises, and everyone knowshow to anticipate our next steps and their next steps. As a result of back,I make sure that there are weekly synchronization meetings between myteam members and the field sales rips. I have ongoing same meetings with that,our head of sales- and I think that the nice thing about this closedcollaboration is the fact that they see us as partners, because when they wantto now launch a new sales initiative in their market, they come to us first,like they speak to us. They consult with us and we do stuff together and wesupport them. So I think that we managed to create a real teamenvironment between sales and marketing in the different markets that we workit or for the different products, and it's you need to do a lot of smallthings that will aggregate to a good collaboration. But if what drives youI'm going back to the beginning, if what drives you is that the sales andthe marketing teams are really sharing the same goals and the same measurement,then I think that's the starting point to a Ligne say e Sertin right Tousova.Thank you so much for going sor that, because this is proper, indestransistype of advice of what you are doing like not just like theority Col ov viewof what should be done. But but that's what you are doing you know I waslistening very, very atatively and what comes to my mind, tat. The end of allthose things that you went through is really you know to get your bread out.You need to build the your own braind intamily. You know Youare steanking,about being a messive advocate fout for personor Brending, but that'stechnically what you are doing with in Yo r organization at Yorivo, themarketing team level and at the serves a marketing team, walking together alover, okays wouh've, a different level of Brandin there, and I really likethat because it does actually does make sense and M. my next kind of Questi isbut management because I was, I feel ashamed to say it, but I gu say: Tid:You were whas kind of partcularly when we fist startin the toporitics reallyearly on. I was not a big belever in branding just so that you know, Brandinwill come from wod of mass okay. Brending will come from. We do a goodjob for someone that someone will speak to their friends and then you go tosomeone es except try, etc. And then the Fon starts ringing and that's okay,when your mom and pokshop smool business, but then, as time went byteambition can of change, and you know I think I've said that Torigon e she onthe Shew podcast, but one day, fididt know if he was peserved with anIstraeli company thet ar now giants of us. Actually they just become heclients recently two months ago, but I met with O cou in London and is a look.I've Houd a lot about you. I've noad a lot of good things about theparitics,but really the only thing, I'm not sure is. Can I Ford your services and that,for me, is kind of Fockay this? Is it so old, themot witinivers an breadbuilding is that sentence was like okay, I've got the metization of what itmeans. Now it's putting Min that category, where maybe the world ofmouses as ll, but also all your ar things that we've done the way wecommunicate about the success, because technically what you Gore doing,entotraly whath you just went through...

...is what a company should do for thatbranding is to speak about what theyare doing communicate, not wait for someoneto communicate, not wait for someone else to do something: Everybody shouldcommunicate. It goes from the cleaner, the Cleaner Shul Sai that I'm happy togo and clean that company. I is a great company to Grad for Ou to the COU. Youknow, and everybody should really push that message out and I think we reallyach why we actually been isn't wolking progress, but we are much better artit,but God de Take Montins to move to convince me. So I'd like to undersonyou if it's just me that was an issue for my uncle b Yon botter neck or doyouse o face that wit silvel wit, sis, with what people are like ISO, CFO orCo. Athet kind of you know is of technieo technical Minddad of FinanceMinday and don't really get the concert of breading until they actually see ityeah. So you hit the nail on the head. It's not just your problem. Many peopledon't get it Iwell, don't don't get it because they think, like you, that youknow it will come if it needs to come and we're doing a good job. It willcome from other people, and I agree with you that there is nothing betterthan word of mouth. That's the best marketing method heads down. However,in order to get to word of mouth, you need to work all right. It doesn'thappen very quickly to get to word of moth and in order for people to starttalking about you like that customer of yours heard about you, fror manydifferent people that takes some work and if you don't put who you are in avery clear in a very compelling way out there, other people will not startdoing it for you without any Incentiv, or you know just because your nice andthey had a good experience. I mean some of them will do it, but it's the onlylike the minority earlier dapters. Most people want to it. So if you givepeople the tools and if you give them the messages and you give them thevisual tools and you teach them what's important and what's valuable and whatyou would like them to say about you, they would probably do it because yougive them everything and then it's very easy work for them to do. But you needto give it to them, because most people are too busy and they don't have timeto do your work for you right. So there's a way to push in a way word ofmouth to drive it, and I think that every person can relate to that.Whether there is CFO or a C or a technical person or a salesperson canrelate to the fact that the best way to be convinced is, if someone told youabout something and gave you a good recommendation. So if you cancommunicate clearly to your peers, andto those tough people that the workyou'll do is will is essentially a driver for word of mouth. They willconlaborate with you yeah and you're, absolutely right that a brand for forthe marketing team and a brand for sales and marketing and a brand for aperson who does the work is as important as the brand of thecompanyself yeah right, and it all starts with like clarifying foryourself. Who Am I? What are my values? What's my personality, mycharacteristic, how would I like to be perceived WHO's, my target audience andthen go for it so in this twocase, like my target audience, is my emplays inthe company right, Yeah Yeah or my my sea level calling yeah- and I think youknow also work. Some company comes shot and lets less point on the Topikis.They always have one persen. That is the brand builder. So you see a lot ofcompanies whire. The CMO is the bread builder and the Shupe Activ. They sharea lot of fings, Lin and stuff like that. But then nobody is like is on his own.You know- and I think that's that's okay, but and what we trying to do. AUtoporotics is stactually, say to Ourour guys. You know, because we've got a lotlot of Varyapon playrs. You know, we've got people who arready appear fromevery stage in the company, O d people...

...will ge at the bottims and people ar inthe middle some people at the top. The people tend to be reatively appy and wetry to keep them appy. His is important, a becaste MES. You know a big absorryAPI stuff. WOKIOM ploys makes a bigger Omach right, but we trying to encouragethem to communicate more and so wan don't be shy, know speak about yourexperience. Onthing Tan, be honest, be yourself! We don't need to writesomething for you. Marketing don't need to put that face together. You resarysomething like that that podcast the Pisot for examplee is is Nacuallybrending from me from Ome brending. Is You saying about your experience? AsaIndividual Wichin, the company to the rest of the world and sa I's tellingabout Somtin that you've achieved? Okay, obviously in the respecting the Nga,but that will give identity that will give character, and I will give youknow. I think what I would be seeking for, if I was to biges is, is just whatpeople cal that people don't care about: Youn Yeu, wite paper on you podcast andthings likeat unless theyarpen to know someone or it's of interest, O them, OLett, Pickis of interest to them and they're doing some selfeducation at thepoment. But quite frankly, when you look at those social network wet I'mspeaking about Clintong in Bocktula, it's crowded, yeah prowdit. So whatyou're? Looking you're looking for? Reall, emotion, real connective, youknow- and I that's what weare trying to do at the moment: The exorphise ofemotional connection, emational brand building, thrue guys just Piak aboutyour experience, because what you tell me is beautiful. I love to EritinDanely. Now, let's go and share it with the world and that's what Yo're tryingto give an example. I Mus give you an example about exactly what you'retalking about so the other day we had one of our community managers.Community sales managers in Neoland receive avoce flowers to the officefrom one of our customers. Ther company called Tink from Sweden. They do like afinancial payment yeah and I it's a large company Tim, so they sent her abouquet of flowers to say thank you for the beautiful process she took themthrough to sign their least in our office, so there a CAS where theyre ahappy customer right and then they sent our flowers in the end of the processafter they signed the contract saying that they took. I don't remember if itwas fifty or a hundred people office in pollen and they sent us the. I mean theteam in collen sent us the photo of the lady with the flowers, and I told themstraight away. Why are you sending it to me perfect? Please upload it tofirst of all the Polland Flincon page and we have a polen placebook pager,but to your individual pages and be proud of your work. They askd for somehelp, so I gave them a little bit of text to put and they upload the photoof her with the flowers and we tag cink and we said thank you and they all didit, and then I did it as well and then the whole company, almost the wholecompany Didt everybody knew about Ito and they posted it, and it was one ofthe most successful posts we ever had on linke in imagine like twenty orthirty different people shared it the same photo, and so it was like burnt inpeople's minds and then the story of how a customer is saying. Thank you.After a sales process, you know is something quite unique, reallypowerfullier and a lot of other people said like in the Commons wel. This isone of the best you know proofs. There are for who you are as a company likeyou, don't need to do much more than that Esoit's about listening, Reallyanand giving your employees the power to do it like listening to what ishappening in the field and then once something happens and there's a trigger.You just encourage them to use their power and absolutely but there is.There is a sort of resistance I think from people. Well, I always spaking toone of my stuff is like Looki, this fantastic. You should share up Im Legin,a I don't know I don't know is like you know, I follow your instagram. I cansee your diner pretty much every day, which I don't care about. PRIHT, that'snot teay Bret goodday. If you are to actually share that stuff. This is thesort of things you want to Shur. This is meaningful, but there is aresistance of O. that's a bit of Quub. What would my coliague think about me?What other people would think about me?...

But actually, I think you know in thebusiness world it is nice to be nice. I think it's also sending a fantasticmessage to Wi think as a company right, because that act of kindness is sonlyat Tex. Two minutes right to get someone some flowers, you just need toget your cat ready go on the website. Both of you go, that's beautiful fromthem. Wever done that in their company is also a great advocate for ThetCompany brain because doing that is such a gesture. You know it's a simpletings doesn't COTC fess money next someodnes day, we make sure yoursaieswild, be good. After very simple thing, like a Saink, you please you know, butanyway we could get on forther, because at's, I'm tpnal brandingbecause yourYot. Your enployes problem is something that everyone has and it's that balancebetween being humble and eafraid of how you'll be percived and people are justtoo busy being humble, and they gont understand that during that time, thattheir humble many other people are like crossing the Hydea with showing offtheir achievements and they're losing business. So yeah there's a woll otherepisode. We should be boutthat well before et you go to. I've got onequestion for you, so I know that you'rete, the Cofondo of Gcabo, whichis a community that brings together Istraan, stops cmmo from globalcompanies startups, and this is, it would be great if you could tell us alittle bit more bout gsiable and what motivateed you to stop that communityyeah good good one. So JCMO. We started the community about two two and a halfyear, two and a half three years ago, and we started very small because we'rea group of CMOS that just needed someone to consult with. Sometimes youdon't have anyone else in the company that shares the same problems andchallenges. So you go to colleagues and so a few few of us just came togetherand in started building and before we knew it were one hundred people fromsome of the biggest global companies in Israel. You probably know some of themlike andogs or you know, Patra pariant, a lot of tech, but not just so to stramglasses. You would say, like there're, a lot of consumer be to see, but alsobe to be, and basically we wanted to position Israel. Israel's top marketingexecutives, as word leaders and marketing, because many people know, isral to be very good with developing technology, but they don't know enoughhow we're good, with also driving that growth of the start of nation, with theway we tell stories in the way we do marketing. So that was the first goal.The second one was to create a community that will support and providea think tank for us as CMO. So we can consult each other and the thirdobjective was to create a networking and career development platform for theCMOS, because it's also it's a small country. We have a lot of positionsthat are coming out and marketing and we can help each other with advancingin our career. So one of the things that I'm really proud of is the factthat, Oh, I forget to say, we have a wat of group for the Stogram Hanepeople yeah, and we talk daily in the wattsup group. So imagine it whats agroup that on a daily basis, you have discussions not every week every day,so one unry people ake buzzing with questions to each other. Like who useoperatics before, can you recommend them? Can you give me a good vendor forPR in Japan? You know how do you manage a team with bonuses or whatever kind ofquestion you can think about it's being put there and just people help eachother, and so we do demos together for platforms for marketing technologyplatforms. For example, we do academic programs with universities where someof our CMOS are speakers, those programs helping the next generation ofmarketteers to learn about global marketing. We do speaking opportunitiesand various conferences round table sessions to consult with each other. Weprovide career support. So when someone is leaving a position, they tell theforum that they just left. So people...

...know that if there's an opportunity,they will connect them or we as the founders, we help people that are inbetween jobs to get opportunities. So it's a really unique experience. Wehave the WATUP group on a daily basis. We have one to two professional sessiona month right now, it's a zoom because of GROWNA, but normally it's once ortwice a month in someone's office, just host the whole community, and we getsponsored by Google, for example, or other branding agencies that want tohost us a and do things less. So I think it's a very powerful tool for usas individual CMOS, but also for us as a group to get better offers fromvarious sources from Beir stake holders, but also, I think the best thing isjust the fact that you can. You Know Pink someone and get an advice and gethelp within minutes, so cvs of employees go in and out of the groupevery day, like here's, a great guy who does SDR is a great guy who does grow agreat lady. Who Does you know, communications and PR who wants to hirethem et CTERA. So it's a beautiful tool and CMO is yeah. It's a great community,so you can follow us on social media. We have WII will tat t like that. ItsINFI, we see Lotmitril, like you, know, people getting together and there is avery strong community, the rest of the worstack example- and I think it's agreat way to go interviewed several times about the Modo and how we did it,because just to share the knowledge with other countries, we may take itintoernational Onday, but for now o go drink, big, and I would say also thatwe have a podcast called the marketeers and Capes it's an English, so you canfind it on pobiter and Cape like Chicaos in Cav, yes, and one of ourmembers is actually the host of the podcast, his name is Athan and heinterviews a different GCMO member every month. So I it's very interesting,wonderful! Well, thanks for ATE Frat, it was wonderful T, elve youon. Theshow today, as you say, were probably in another session to speak about ofnot branding, but before we we get going. Les's question to ask is ifanyone wants to get in touch with you to discuss mone space to discuss GC,but what's the best way to connect with your friends, I think the easiest islinked in I'm on twitter and placbook as well, but linkon is where I do mostof my professional stuff. So that's, okay! There you go so that's Efrot,fening son, which is fenig son and Afrot Efrat very simple. It waswonderful to have yonder show. Thank you very much for coming today. Thankyou for having we you've been listening to be to berevenue acceleration to ensure that you never miss an episode subscribe to theshow in your favorite podcast player. Thank you so much for listening untilnext time.

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