B2B Revenue Acceleration
B2B Revenue Acceleration

Episode · 7 months ago

100: Becoming a Unicorn: A Journey of Rapid Growth & Scale

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

It’s the dream of many tech companies — becoming a unicorn,meaning that the company has reached a valuation of $1 billion.

On this special 100th episode, we hear stories from a panel of guests about how their companies reached or helped other companies reach that milestone, the challenges they encountered along the way, and the tips they have for others aiming to do the same.

Our panel includes:

Didi Dayton, Partner at Wing Venture Capital

Dimitri Sirota, CEO of BigID

Thomas Been, CMO at Druva

Thibaut Ceyrolle, EMEA Founder at Snowflake

To hear this interview and many more like it, subscribe to The B2B Revenue Acceleration Podcast on Apple Podcasts, on Spotify, or on our website.

Listening on a desktop & can’t see the links? Just search for B2B Revenue Acceleration in your favorite podcast player.

You're listening to Beto B revenue,acceleration, a podcast dedicated helping software executives stay on thecutting edge of sails and marketing in their industry. Let's get into the show hi welcome to be to be a reveneacceleration. My name is on Amiy, and today we are celebrating a veryimportant minstone for podcast. We have reached hundred episodes the Jonystarted two and a half years ago, and and over the under EPESOS. We woke upsome amazing guests within the BI to B Tech space, take industry that sowssome great insights with yow audience arliseners. So yowould like to thankyou as well for listening to our show. Some of you have been very vocal,reaching out asking formo and we really appreciate that this is what we want.We want some fit back on what we are doing and, to be honest with you, wereach Yon Repisor, simply because we saw an appetites Wi, so peopleencouraging us and sometimes it's difficult to keep going so again, amassive thank you to Augience, because without Youe the show would not exist.FROR teenderals episode. We are proacasting the Odu of a recent virtualevent that operatics promoted and that event was titald becoming Unicorn. AJourney of rapid growth and scame well end up some great panalist, and thatshows some very unversikin sight and I ope Tet to gays enjoy te pisod. Today,let's get into the show. Okay, everyone welcome to Ivens todaybecoming UNICON A journey of rapid growth and scame. I'm Olin with J, theCO and Cofondo of oporatics operatic is a company that ABS be to these softwarecompanies to accelerate by bling and revenue across EMMEA and North America.Today I have the pleasure to welcome a fantastic: U Fondansa, bunch of PanetisTattualy Cart, a font bunch as well. We will be sharing outhe Avand, thecompany to become UNICON UNIGON. If you don't know what that is, is a companythat is reaching evaluation of one billion dollars to nuts quiteinteresting and quite an achievement, but before we daye into theconversation, what I wanted to encourage all the people who would belistening onto the cool today is to share question shut. Our thoughts inthe chat just o wecan towards the n of the conversation, go back to thosequestions and shot this question with the penaties. So they can ge you theanswer. So, let's stark Weh some introduction. Ladies First DD Yonogoand briefly introduce yourself whin DC the company you represent yeah. I thinkYore, it's anote to be here and thanks so much it's great to be here in such asteam company. My Name Is Didi Dayton and I'm a partner at wearing venturecapital. My role is to bring innovation to our cxo community, which is aboutsixty thousand enterprise executives N. I and also Tok ov our portfolio companyaccess to our customers. So I spent the last twenty years as a global operatorand hypergross startof, three of which were actually unicorns, I'm based inCalifornia, and I'm also my household it department. Thanks for that, did you thinks forthat dmitre? Will you like to go next? Yes, Sir happ to Everybodymtonaco acofounder commny called BGID, we're Hendcournd in New York. Were I'mcalling you from and then we have develoment intalbee and roughly aboutfive years old, the Tren of people fread around the world, Europe in theUS, Israel, Asia, Likeamerica, etcee Gotto, be Er that you were having me.Thank you, Demetra Tomas everybody. My Name is Thomas Bean andthe S and chief marketing officer at Druva. Dida Protection Company wereabout eight hundred employes president globally, and before that I spentfifteen years in a company called tip co, doing integration analytics and haddifferent lives, starting from presells, tes and then marketing to all rollsfocused on the on the customer interaction, good anless Butnot, at least Tibo helloon Ili everybody. My name is Tibo Saul, so im the neer from the OFFORAS Noflikso high of in March, seven. Seventeen. So, four years high up to build up FOMscatch, the business in Euro Middle East Africa, I work in the softwareindustry for more than twenty years, so fors no fick I've been the firstemploye outside the US and I starte the Sadon Thoni, very small Shis and EveaPolishammo Inver smol ses on Petdington and Skillsis dusiness. Now in fourteendifferent different countries, yeah, you must have done well.Something was good in the in the meder...

...thanks to Bo, so so coming back to aTopickan and getting a started guys. Fas O to the introduction. We know thatcurrently there are about five hundred tic companies that have reaged te onebillion dollar evaluation around the world and that's including a huge number ofstarter being funded across the globe, but only one percent of them actuallymake it to the UNIQ Conte, so forst ofall wealen for all of your gays, foryour participation, making that one Person Min your Kasedd Robian Ting offew organization to get there. But what I would like to Onderson is: Was ityour plan guys when you started so and maybe dimy tree you? You would be agood person to ansor that question, but was it something that you actuallyplanned was was dad to become a uniqor when you sart inthe business, wwat wil?What did you start? Ta droning yeah, so only he the intentioas to grow abusiness this all my prior Compani. So I think this time around an cope was tobe able to build a business that could sustain and remain dependent. No alongthat trajectory. You know: Pobly Sacred, O prubably you're, probably going to bean expessive, a million dollars evaluation, so yeah, so it wasn'tnecessarily about being a Unicorn as much as was about building an IIPENDOFcompany and t en growing it out. So that was that was the call good whe as been in for years is quite,is quite achievement. So, what's next, when you get there,basically, I guess would be my question Wel when you ridgjed good. What'swhat's left yeah olthere's, there's Jeckacor, there's there's Cannicor! No,so I think of the day you try and build the business nowbeing unicornus. I don't think as unique as it used to be so you mentiureone percent of companys kind of a reach, Sid ouse tone. It seems almost daily.You know you seen annoucement from tier global avinteing somebody else's as theUNOF car and I think theye doing that an Unicorn dealday Soa. I don't thinkthat is the endpoint. Clearly you want to build a business. Be Business is notpredicated on having a forse with a horn, its foundon having revenue and Havny customers that are preference of all Anbo o thinkthe man gimeration was that you guys do it on products. So there's a lot ofthings that you worry about as a cofounder of a company. I think it'snice to certainly get a recognized as as a UNICOR. It gets through our panelslike like we are today but hopefally. I think the focus is always about how webuilt build ruling business riht, so that I mean so o an ightline services.You know supporting customers, those kind of things yeah that makes perfectand sanks you me strait. So did you mov into your wing, invested in severalvendors at very early stage? In fact, twenty two of your company pot for you,a acty billion dollar plus outcomes, intom evaluation. From your perspective,what are the traids that VC are looking for or should be looking forwandtheyare decided to Invese the found otherani specific pattern as you try,Todontifi or to go after yeah, and maybe I'll share a little bit aboutwhen so. You understand who we are, and our investment strategy we're an earlystage investment ten. So we were founded by Peter Wagner from exel andgrave guard from Saqoa what we invest in his typically seed and serious acompanies before it's obvious and the great example of that is nowplake. Weinvested in two thousand and twelve and sniff like in their seedground. Thatwas very much before I was obvious that they would sort of take over. You knowa lot of this cloud transformation. You no effort, Thas happened, so ourinvestment strategy. We believe that the modern enterprise is data drivenand we made concentrated bets in certain focal areas which has helpedgenerate that twenty two billion and Ow cones for Apot Ollyo. What do we lookfor? We look for category creators. We look for founders that have a customerfirst mindset and the passion, ofor excellence. It was great to hear Dmitri,say that and n no customer first and we look for the size of the market. Welook forny friction getting to that market and differenciation of theactual solution, so Idealuso work for companies that have founding teams withexperience and drive and the way that we support those companies is wo, givethem three things. We give them funding, we give them talent and we give themaccess to customers, which is what I do so. I help shape that relationshipbetween those first customers, sometimes for product market fit andthen a lot of times it's the earliest customers that they get and try tobuild a a solid foundation in their domand generation, and you knowcompliment that with their engineering, so the foundation basically getting Oyeahwhat. You guys do too right. In fact, you know...

...we've also, we've heard so many of thise Compayahave gon. You know done some some fantastic stuff of tie. I was speakingto to some of my vendars recently and I picked up on one particular discrussionthead with one of them and what he was telling me is o look. We are cloudsecurity and now category tevaluation is thirty time the revenue. So reallywhat I want from opratics is: How can you get us to thirty three million ow?Can we walk together because it's not just tes, of course, but to get to serthis three million dolnars of a new retorin revenue of thirty four Minliensorty three point: Five soward we'le doing the mass, but as basically whatthey were looking at is that the sort of vanuation that companies are lookingat is cirty times revenue and the way we should be looking at it did Y oranyone eelse by the way yeah Dmitro Migh want to help answerthat question as well here. So the numbers you going down as Enn security space. You know I won'tcall ut the companies, but I believe F, both two that are well underten and youknow I believe under five. So what I think I think, increasingly the youknow, I thin there's a different kind of calculation that people are doing, Ithink, is correctly. Certainly it was a multiple revenue and you know maybe itsome poin dustry was muple of earnies or profit. I think today it's Moralydriven by size of addressable market and I think people are using adifferent kind of ECH mark. It's lot easier to go a lick anout throughspacks Directlety, the capital Ras, and so I think irecently people are saying.Well, you could be. You know, number one, two or three in a market there's avehicle for you to probably go public, and now it seems that the currentvaluations are really measured on Afra like so I I think it's kind of invertedwhere people are looking at the end point and say: okay. Well, I can try toget in it want at that price and that's a that's, a fair calculation. I thinkit's you know a again, maybe in AL reverse, but I do thank Yoven from thetime we started bigie. Where was more multiple on revenue, you', certainlyseen expansion and those multiples thut, I think over the last year, and maybejust during the period of pull bit, it seems to Hav detach completely fromfrom revenue whatsoever and seems to flip more on. You know what is thiscompany going to be wort when it got public? Okay, I mean, I think theconsensus is that evaluations are insane yeah. That's probably what I wasgoing Isit. Is it AAS? You say Toie probbla that conversation literallythree months ago with the clients, and it seems that since that is things havechanged already, so you can do it a bit less and still still get there so thatthat's so. Does that mean that we just putlike a a temp Pon it and you could have a fantastic technology and we thinkyou've got a great fushor. So there you go, you got of the INICON TRAPO or doyou need to be to Afigt to be financially solemnly? Was Th? Was theminimum because the technogy is great, the ficture is great, but o'll. Do youow? Do We detaman, who is putting this valuation? Is it the market is in thevcs? Is the LARG organization that wants tomake a Quisition Loi he on Ting, then you're, seeing and maybe I'll kind ofjust voluteer, at least at Ar lats right know. I kind of part about myperspective that weve seemed to Unteather it from from cunmultiples on revenue, and Ithink today the investor Sou thorly are the ones that are minting the uniforncsright and you've seen a lot more companies enter. What I think sometimesare characterize is prossoveror funds that maybe were public. HEASH funds areinvestent Wi companies, there's a number of them you've, seen pe fundsagain involved. You certainly seen large ascid managers get involved andwith more money, chasing deals and again they're coming in because it'sthey're getting a discount to the public price right. That's for thereason you're seeing this kind of change in incalculation, because you'regetting public investors that are coming in and buying bience privatecompanies that to them seem like a bargain. Maybe to some of the earlierinvestors seem exaggerated inflated, but I think that's part of the part ofthe change that you've seen but yeah. Look at the investors decide if you'reworth something right. You get a trumchy, there's a number there andthat's your you know that's kind of a how much theyre investing I a a FreMondy, that's your valuation, and so I think that they're deciding it and youthink that in part of your seen so many new people come into the technologyarea and and they're competing one another and again for them. This alllooks cheap because it's a lot cheaper than when a company goes public, and soyou know, I think, that's part of the inplation you've seen okayi. Think thatmakes sense. Chanse just to, as you said today seems to be seems to begoing aittae bit crazy, Shi, which is good. I guess for if you're t you of ofAti Great Yoroter, yeah exactly itkeop moving onto you now you join snowflake,as you mentioned in two thousand and seventeen and new werll, the first manon the ground INEMEA to build up the...

Europe an organization you know. Couldyou please share with us a bit more about the Jony and scaling up abusiness as well as expanding into newr region, but also with success becausecleary guys with Gapu Don St it's been a success. Successful venture it isyeah, it is. It is for wood reasons. I think, on top of whatdeity was sayingand think what we can add on top on. Vagation is a poteladisable market andwhat what companies can? What piece of this Pogeahasbe MIGTA COMTEX? So so?Yes, so foundtitis is a very, very large success. So I started all Iketesin the Ukso when I joined the company was valuated like tonlit million, so itwas. It was obviously weyghs more than Dran and I started all the ex orjts inthe UK. It was the first choice to storp. So first I was there, so I haveeHes, O Beautiful ooks, fom excellent, but I French and it's terrible, but it'sdiffentficunt to change you Akon Bas, but it was the first choice to start inthe UK for clad matrity. The market was excellent and also an Millydecan an addon this, but for American companies. It's Ti a very good place to startbusiness in the UK compared to o to other othe origins. So at the beginning,we focuse red onlearning the market with technology asa backonical system,because when I started there was nothingiw when we started people arethinking. We were sitting ice creaming because you have some nice, slow, flege,ice, cream, shopin, London, so a true story, and at the beginning Iwas I was starting to thing. A good bet that perfected is to hire somebody thatcan skaills the business. I'm not necessary, aving one sense guy just totest, because we were condensed bycotechnogies but the beginning. My I was Maak on IRIN and I tookh whatthey call histecuers and Blase, and I was also looking at his Ta customels,because when you start O it's good it', it's a very. It was a very goodtechniogy, but you need to Pov yourself and when you start a business in inEurope, one key factor for me was during potent was a Tust of the EXAC inthe US, because Temi thins in New York, but yey've got of Mo fates in San Matoin San FANCISCO. So when they wake up it's three PM for me, so I need to beal. The team to be autonommos quickly so very quickly. When I started, I saidto them Oka we need to act like it's, our own company and and acting likethis alpostreally having in sort of Footo me at the beginning and also thedecisions, and I was followed by the BASICEC on this, which was very good.So we started to do a lot of firing a as I was sying a lot of biclanegeneration so to talk about and do some some wanes and very quickly what theyshop. The team is Wewe are your dience. We are not. We are weare working forthe Amerigian Company, but in Europe people don't buy into American storiesso at the beginning, son gain, but you need local resoences. So wot we werereally the customer Maiac to Mak sure that will have a lot of customers tostart and also fos to really really to have the rightefoanseason. As soon as we have thist. We had some some good successes in theUK. I was looking outside to see where we go and we need a dive analysis onothe market, so it's sling to Sponoflik, but we went first to the nodics. Sonodix is a very interesting region, so it's multiple countries, but they haveseen united and the ATHERETIC texd and the IBL to de creased and also byngatuor. We are cloud soutions, he wotd have aninpassuture and, and we wentthere, we weare quite successful in Mo diks, and I taw that we, after Athin ofyour one, I Open Germany and friends, and and nowwe have fifteen countries with a backnaical systems that elpus tooperatein in twenty one countries. So I can give way more details, but tasea littlebit, Tegoi Johnny were was very important tohave this CIS takeyour mindset at the beginning, because when you are realyunknown on the market that you need to Ave some people that can trusto okay,that makes sense to wo thanks for that, but I think with the question coming upin the in the QNA. Maybe we can address now, because I think there is a littlebit of of an interesting sor. So we've got a Frenchman in London. That's tooon the court today guys. But you know the question is that there isa thir seems to be UK attraction for us, Tartus or even Australia, startup infact to storp their business from the...

UK des. Does anyone of you, N, Porty,co? ACTEOPL will have any comment about that. Experience Reason: Why is justthe longuage? No it', not onthe language, so so I'm Frencaliof my try.But honestly I no leave k and the break was not was not something also top of my mind when we need rives.I shink in Suppession of the its anditial to sitiont aspect, but rightnow what you're seeing is in the UK? It's easy, probably more easito to thebusiness, sometimes also the shoul. Look at the DITION H. Agility of themarket is a extemear goes expen fast and we seem the UK as Litl us,sometimes in term of disems co in the US. People are very PLAGMATEC, and, and sometimes if you go in Sols Yuob orin sertain countries, the Quistian musiquition mom, what youwhat you are doing, and so you need to pule yourself in the gay, but therefast an taking decisions. I think it's still something the re attact you. Iknow that some people are thinking about Amstadam, sometimes and talkabout transel or barries it'sthebue started because sustaidingforces isgreat when it's Talin and I hadd some descision of pisiition still and it's a shame too much too muchlocated to friends an thinks. UK avthis international reposure that help ThiKill Business for American companies at plist because I spend my life Wy doingthat working for Morican companies in in Europe, yeah o agree from Ourwnexpanence, but we see in fact we I've had the conversation with a couple ofcompanies were ligning up by PS, I would say the next six two twelvemonths, werk clients of ofthobraticsn and we actually started them in Europeoutside of the UK. Simply because in the UK they would have some very, verystrong competition, lots of vendor that are already there and you go to France.You go to Germany, you good to Italy. I think there is also a lot of clisha about this country. You know youcan't set in France. If you don't go for lunch with people you can't star inGermany folisn. You know. I don't believe that I do go. AAn Ttyialis Jus for an you knowhat, butyou know there is just cistion, I think, actually going into markets where people are as much educated, asprobably in the UK board the issue, but ave less option. It should be a better bet in term ofselling them intem of growing, but yeah. The UK seems to be the place whereeverybody comes and the competition is ratively false. I think on this OnetinOso, but what I felt, because I itany opens fifteen different countries, soso I so difond a level of Matrit. If you look at friends, it's funny to Fontasti country to bewith very large companies, but the time that it's going in Ha metro market, youneed to have binings and in the UK I'm coming back to this hister jar. I hadthis feeling O weard, not disfeeling, but we were din to find Alistatascompany even large one at the beginning in other countries. Sometimes it takesmore time. You need to have a lot of local refeences before before being AinYo right, place, intema. I agree and there's also the element ofestablishing an entity outside of your core market. You know which can bereally expensive, given the amount of investment that it takes, particularlyin France- and you know some of these other countries, where you know hiring,is no small feet, especially for those first fo Peopo. Give you a lot ofcredit for getting people on board, because it does require a lot ofcommitment and investment forward, and you have to have the legal resourcesand outside of the the UK and Ireland market. But I think the other thing isjust having the resources for earlystage companies to get technicalsupport and also you know the amount of emphasis, and you know, countries likeFrance and, as you move your way down, Eurupe there's an increasing emphasison hardware solutions versus sufferand Zas and that's another element that alot of innovation is coming from from cloud based, an cloudfir security orcompanies in general, I'm from security. So it just kind of rolls right off theTine, but security is also obviously a bigcomponent of that with you and GPR yeah. You know, and in our particular case we,since we had a privacy centricity Woel we wel we launched today. I would saywe're probably more around kind of Dato Management, but because of that we didactually go into Europe plane early. We...

...did also Lauchang UK and it's ourlargest European office and headquarters for us for international,but yeah s you could you could hire more easily, you can fire more easilyit's easier to create an MPT. I think it's a nice kind of in between it's,not as rescriverse as the continent. Generally speaking, you don't need tohave twenty Yoreference Woll customers to to win your first. People arewilling to take a little bit more risk, not as much as the US TAT's Oa e alittle bit yeah. I think it's a just a very convegient place lot, but evonsaid that there's clearly business everywhere, vernick start terific. WeAE on France, Yoav people in Germany, Switzerland, yours O ha place, and what about the shortage of talentsspeaking about the people and recruiting people? So we speak aboutthe risk. tace and stuff like that. So probably remember, starting operaticsnine years ago has Beena and we teen, not a union, believe it on a demetry.This isthis is C, but I remember going to conferencis. Couldit be? We made the big data security conference Te Dimension. You Know Ale,saying in the most connicenter manyels, probably puber in Sice, sothere is more van Tos al those vendors, of course, not not only it's not aEurope and problem. I think it's also in the US. How do you find the rightresources when there is so much demand for Kinow Tech People? You KnowMarketing People, you know sells people. It's got to be very, very, verydifficult to find the right people yeah a lot of early stage. Companiesrely on their vcs for that. In addition to specific you know, talent, agencies.We have a whole talent team, that's dedicated specifically for that purpose,but it but you're Righti is a cha yeah. I be God me Gnoarmaid, as we got in Tebid more mature and at the where withall and obviously this is wherehaving a uniforn kind of label is helthful, but frankly, goingto your older, more starty competitors. I think it's a great place. Torcrupright. I think they have less positive kind of futures or outcomes orpossibilities, and I think theyare a great there there in Eur Train. Theyknow your space, you can make the productive and in months, not ninemonths, and so I think for us across the board.They've already established beacheds in a lot of these places, and I think weprodactively go Antooret kind of older, slower competitors that were on thatkind of the data security data privacy do mat it space, yeah, okay, yeah makespetlic sense, so them a moving on to you and from a marketing pespective alittle bit more now. What is it like for marketer to be part of a firstprowing company? How do you manage Tomulity Por Strategy? The branding, I guess you've got a part to playbecause you know coming back to some of the things that we discuss or eownabout. How do you put a vaiulation on the company? I think if you make a lotof noise and people see you everywhere and you've got good pr and you accievethat may end so whar's the journey from a market or pospictive. I think I willfollow U Barecly from what Tbo was saying, an which is and how he startedin Europe. I think the piorities that you're going to have first isestablishing hoeet some awareness. What are you standing for and Valey dated? Itotally agree with Tibo's point about having customers the voice of thecustomers very powerful to valudate, you, that's where you O, how you gofrom ristakers to more conservative customers and reallyget your name out frequently, but always associated to value and then theother priorities. Of course, what I would call tdhe main generation, buthow do you contribute also to to revenue? And how do you start reallyfocusing on that value to get the right conversations going? Get yourselvesengine get your also a cosystem of partners. That's how I think you candirectly contribute to growth, and so those would be the toperities, but Ithink it's also about how you connect those and how you connect marketing tothe rest of of the of the company. I think the focus is critical. There arealways many many opportunities. The business is Nimble and small, so itcould do a lot of things, but it's really on what are you going to choosein alignment with your SELV team or your partner team? What are you goingto focus on customers for us being a cloud company as DDS? Mentioning wasit's our major different ater and I also now Frek were doing, did aprotection which istorictly has been mostly market of hardware and software,but from the cloud in a SAS model. So how do we stay always focused ineverything we do on that aspect? I think the other element is the clarityyou can't afford to to be a bit vague, so you need to clearly state the valueand be consistent about how you talk about the value. Your message is yourvagecal to do so, and you always need to highlight your your difference beingconsistent on that aspect. I think it's pretty good. That's what helps snowballthe demenion, an awareness, aspict and...

...then the third element is always havean eye on ongrowth. We spoke a lot about being becoming Unicorn being amoutstone fine, but westthe journey beyond it. I think our go all of us isto build studid businesses, keep on delivering value and expanding how wecan create this adue. So there's notion of skill in mind in a way on themarketing side. Who are you going to hire a theyre going to be yourfoundation for the for the next year? How are you also skilling the way you engage withyour customers as your partner, but also how you learn? I mean what'sfascinating, especially aboutsas businesses, how everything is connectedand we have a wealth up data. So how do you vary eardy on on the marketing, butnot only marveing, marting and Seles etc? How do you keep on learning andfinding the the needle movers there's never enough time and resources? So howdo you really learn to identify ident figh it the good opportunities and justjust move forward and keep in growing yeah? Now that makes sense I so it'salmost like it Feelis, like ood journey of Freen, inventing yourself prettymuch fall the time looking listening to customers listening to whats are beeingin the market and kind of adepting your strategy to what's going on his cominstaying to to your principales. But I do think indeed it's it's a good thingto be Opor, gynistic and- and you should be in a position where you cansee those o Itenis, ch, allright so question for of you guys, obriously weunogate from the Werl, I guess from the top of the nontain of being part ofhaving been part of of the unique on journey. But let's talk about thechallenges now you know so I'd like to go round the Tabley, and maybe we canstart Bis Utibu, because y youere critin a firmt of people, you Wen youdo your French, Ridgen and stuff lat that your Trik, we had Tho podcast, where we discussabout some of the challenges that Yo you came across, but yeah o Youno getus started on the challenges to the Jorrny of becoming a Unicorm yeah yeah.You know it's, it's really in just the conversation we just had so onlom, oneof the biggest challengeins r Iranian and I ra the right people and I winfest so and it's very, very different bycountry. So, as I said, socialistic Omin set is not you dont,as is mented everywer Geman. You need. You need to pull yourself infor iron, aplayors on the market. You can find o Moon morescing of Commedaton innoleg inUK, O ones, alons, I'm Sodem EAMP, but just B, still that we had at one point.I think we were Irendo on week. So we became a Mason Tohire. It walk quite well. What we did is soit's very aticulous. I don't necessarily Lyingto Iron Wiso. I don'tknow at the beginning after that, when you have to some signs you can. You caningenealize thes at the beginning, it's almost impessible and we took likethree head Ondes, that we split different regions and each rengensTehad. The were unique contest market, so thete is Cosiuton, so always use. When is rel, I conciled. Soif you, if you are inslihe when you, when you sell your house, you are inone of the really stateagency Bu, we want to see your house even it's a verynice part, so we truth wo have only one eadenter of Terigen and it wolked quitequite well. Lin Linke iring one one mistake I did and we started solition countries andOfer one country we didnon't start with a leader and somebody that could beearlier. Locating in this country, we we started to higher individuals and- and we realize it was a mistake andtook us about six nine minutes to fix. So if you, if you need to hire an rolein tifion countries, we need to was somebody that can be the Futury des,even if it's not somebody that is a manadress win away. Why dedoes Te Teamwit e that and some countries in Europe Ave so many specificipies, that Ainledeis very important and to literally to come back to what Tho e was sying,don't necessarily ree on one point, so I think you are perfictally right Isinon. If you look at engineering or precens, sometimes marketing and Pout macketingpeople, it's easier, and it's coming from the market where we were starding,is to highe very spin self selle peeper, and they are not what Mit. So we deedsome mistakes and it's not necessary a good idea of going a stof elegiscompanies. If you are Diokep Nofekal, was really was not bettercop but rearclub that are also replacing meligosin solutions and on the leges onsolutions,sometimes like Yigo digosols of the market, and it's not necessary whereyou wil, find Chunkin, bedonnas or...

...peeple that can were whatpeople can buyfrom them, because when, if not IIF realexis, so I'm not sayingeverybody is like that. Of course you have very good players, it's IDsitation of pinins and good ponegates in competition, but we realize that the best seven peoplea'm talking about the sees ot the rest. The Best of people are not necessary,Sitam with Pew Competition of companies that you are redleacing when you aremarket market Vido on this, because after that learning the market, aon tesell side is not soperplex and as soon as you have people cotsital, they canlearn and Yeu can we can scile, but what Mik Yor saying of all Orneoufunctions agree that obviously the competition market is Asu, clearabsolutelyto, so I deed some mistakes. On this I hire sinking. Okay, Lov somepeople, the reall Hon put Couky, but I realize that a o Erich, the richealyneed and somekimoae absolutely Brilianso. Yeah juschallenges, Irealy FMO HSR from your pespective Demetru, because I guess,with your rule and being ofonder, you probably have much mal aspects such asyou know, product development and all that sort of great stuff. So I'msuspecting that that's got to be also. Some thiat needs to evolve. Oer TimeWee to have more resources. You know ave you face. Some challenges are oundthat esn charges. You know I you know whatthing, I want to got a comment onis also, I think, supportant for people who are kind of looking at the wholekind of market space, also understanding that there's kind of adownside. I think it does create certain inefficiencys to the marketright where you know historically, think you looke at the lot kind of Ikthe first five years, the two thousand and ten everything was really moreoriented, because there's loss money floating around was more about salesefficiency right. So you wanted to know exactly how much one dollar marketingwould drive in terms of dolls of revenue. pubicly. Can you know you gota salesperson harly can they are rap and I think well, it's still important.I think the overrotation on funding rounds and sizes has created moreurgency around. I different PROEPIC pivority, where you want to increaseyour tab. You want to work, prossel and and upsell to increase your netpretension so fort, and you think that comes back to the engineeringside right,not just the talent, but you know there is more incentive to build bigger to gowider for the Cross. Sell for the upsell- and I think because of that Idid create more ntomed right and I think in a lot of there's this kind ofrace for talent, and so you know we're in Israel, but I think you know westarted. Maybe there was like two three UNICORNS, I think there's forty seven,where we have our engineering and so now you started going and scouring. Thenative, like you know, were, were all the all the Jews made all the off Romlike you brain and bowl it and and ery everywhere else, but you're competingagainst everybody else, and so I dou think that engineering has become harder and Ithink the whole trendwards Unicor is apparently to blame because againyou're more rewarded for building bigger for having more products, moremodule, more Upsev, R procel, and that creates certain EFITIONS B inefficiencis, but also creates lot more competition, yeah. That makes sensetimage tresings, for that did te any specific challenges that you seeapunning over anover again or I think, you're, on MOU didde. Thank you. Yeah. The Road Tiv islittered with great intentions and companies that didn't you know, payattention to what the challenges could be. I have a few so building thecompany, not just a preduct of investing in operations, is a big one,because you're going to need good data later and work clothes and processes atthe exit, and I would also say, when you're looking at new markets, yourtiming to market has to be very calculated, so it's not just entering amarket, you know assessing the size of it, but also understanding your productmarket fit for each market and making sure that you have the correspondingcollateral. So Tibo alluded to that. You know which is just because you'repopular in the US doesn't make you popular globally. I have to have a fewglobal customers that will help seed that demand. You know an other markets,but how a you go after those markets, you really have to do the exercise ofunderstanding what the product market hit is in each of those specific, likefederal, for example, you have to have specific elements in your N, yourproduct and your strategy, to make sure that you have the way to address themarket if it does exist. Another piece is pricing, complexity and making surethat, while you're pricing your product to reach of those markets, you alsohave enough asp to support a a global supply chain and then the lastrecommendation I would I would make his balancing between engineering andcusterr acquisition, because in a very...

...early stage, is a strong emphasis onengineering. But you know at some point you have to pivot and really put youknow the weight of the organization behind customer acquisition, and that's,I think, were dematry was going as well. Yeah Yeah Mat. That makes sense. Thatmakes sense, and I think the operational aspect is probably isprobably important. It's with Anois the first in et you mention because you'reright mean if you're devoping, growing, gaining customers and things like that,and I guess you sturdid as someone who was developing soff to ane- probablyreally good at it, with some great ideas. Thinking about stuff, likecustomer or service, Customal suppots, putting all those things in playsbefore you get stretching on the you know, pressure from customals good tobe good to be soves. You need to think of right. So it's about it's aboutplanning it before it. It technically happend! Well, whatill happen. If youdon't is that you end up as a larger organization having to put manpower tofill in a lot of the gaps, so you can't automate a lot of this stuff fast, anAv San. You have to put in operations from the beginning and really invest inthat area, because, if not, then you just end up with a longer term, morepainful exercise, yeah yeah, thank you, tid that makes perfect sense. Tomasovox youte from a Marketin puspect youany specific challenges, frictionpoint that you came across. Youn Ho does wor to mass yeah thanks.The the biggest challenge on the marketing inside was also to propose a solution that was very farfrom the habits of the market. I mean we're addressing a market that, as foryears, but hardware software, but in a certain way, and we knew there was amarket bid. We had pricing that was easy to consume easy to understand, butit was really a change of behavior and what we did, but we had to do hisknowing that we were to right side of history coming from the cloud offeringas Hass product, but we had to really push that difference forward and reallyprove the value easy, showing the difference of experience showing thatin their countext, how those potential customers can really create a creat, alot of value, but with a pardnrickosystem with the customersthemselves. It took efforts to really find you in thatapproach, which is e. We know we're asking you to make an effort, buthere's the value you can get and really pay our engagement with that withthautvalue. And when you do this right and we have weapons, we can use a this,could not like trions and PCs. You can do very easily and toking marketing andcells. But that's when you start getting those fast customers, then youcan actually go through that cycle, but also I mean dd was talking about theimportance of orperations. This everything that I said can sound verycostly. So this is why you need to also have a very strong operationalbackground so that you realy understand more about your audience and about howyour organization behaves. That's where you can find what weedy moves theneedle yeah to eliminate as much friction as possible right for thecustomer, because there's so much competition right now, especially inassass world, where there's a product led growth, kind of mindset. You knowwith giving access to your product first and then going through sales andmarketing and that's actually. We did a report recently where we were analyzingthe market for startups, and we asked a hundred BCS to vote basically on. Whodid they think were the you know, exciting startups and and number onelast year of a smoke like, which is no surprise, but this year you know at thetop was Howshe for, and we got data breaks and Zaper and a lot of theseother you know upand comers. I think the big idea might actually be on thereas well, and so it's you know, taking a look at at organizations from thatvanish point of how are you going to market, and so not only are you able toaddress it, but then how h more? How much more difficult are you to workwith? Then your competition, and if the answer is very then you're, going toend up feeling that, in your in your revenue on your top line, that makessense, and you TNO ratio top line to investments into sort of aspect thatthat company uses the rule of sumise it is it like a specific fofolatiorganization, you say the intem of whic, you would advises e VC, so if there's a ratio there yes like,for example, would you say look Youe got to invest? Fifty percent of yourrevenue, fofor growth, you know reinvesting the money or I guess thereis reinvesting in the results for using investment O'l be being made, but O nois there? Is there a specific investment that is required or read?Should you would look at to to advise Anecu or cofonder toTorinvest? In that growth te? There is a ratio, I'm sure I don't have anynumbers for you. I think it's somewhat dependent on what space you're in andalso what you'R, what stage you're at, because you know when you're at anearlier stage, you're going to spend the majority of your of your money onengineering and then little by little you're going to reinvest, you know intogrowing the team and then you know...

...going into the market space. So I don't have a specific raceio to me.True, if you have any ideas on that yeah. So Lo, I think I think, as youpointed out, I think you kind of change the topic. It kind of focus on ir not chase to topic, but as you kindof grow out by Kn CD, your you're, much more interested tomand generation andbuilding pipeline and Devertive fihelofline, and you know shortbing theplcs and increasing win ranes and all those type of things like I said I needthe One caviat, though, is: I do think that as more money kind of is thesecompanies are. I tract mor money. Engineering. Historically, I think ofmy prior to companies to start taking kind of a you know as more. I don'tsaymaintenance you still innovated, but it wasn't as as top priority is some ofthese kind of funnal led issues I do think now. IsPeople are trying to increase their increase, their kind of pulogestiblmarket that you're, seeing constant innovation right? There's more pressure,Amember you're competing is other startups that are also Unicorse, Eros,O you, Tur, Lov, Dosin, acornature, right, there's, a Unicorn, and so everycoolwork. I think in a category you get multiple UNICORSE and everyone is outthere building, and so I you think there is more pressure now to build andinnovate on a continuous fashion and make sure that nobody come can comfortbelow you. Nobody cut can comfort above you, nobody can help from the side ofyou and so forth. So I do think that that is something that I haven't seenin my prior companies tbut I'm seeing now a little bit: okay, yeah thanks par Tobe, traip, soAknow or question for Ougd. If I was to invest my money, you know: Is therefrom tisy perspective? What are the most promasing industries at that Tudays Aren'Kinto as becoming the next front of unicoms yeah I mean if you look at you know thethe report that we just published. Therewere a handful of elements in there that were trending to show what what isa strong investment right now. Those have a lot to do with collaboration andproductivity solutions. It has a lot to do with data and data management, inegovernments and then security. So those are the the three sort of primaryvectors that are that are feeling a lot of investment, but I thinktraditionally, when you look at infrastructure, you look at Claudnative applications. You look at Datan, analytics and artificial intelligence.There's there's a lot of there's a lot of great solutions out there B. Thequestion really is about more about the team and the founders you know andmaking sure that you've got great people that have the experience ideallyand have done it before successfully good thanks, foe, DD, thats questionfor you guys, and maybe we can file streight veryquickly. But if you had went to share the number one tip Fostarte bleidlsthat are becoming or aiming to become the next UNICON. What would be the tipgame? Anyone can go. What would be a t thatshe would suggest so Lok? I would say- and this is true-I think- for many companies- and I think it's the T- it's the first kindof value from Amazon. It's the first value for us, our SIGL worr around care.I think the importance of customers right at the end of the day, you'rebuilding software of for yourself, although you may be a proxy for for thebuyer, but hopefully you're builling it for somebody, whether it's a consumer,whether it's small business, whether it's war, Gen prise and I think,throughout you're kind of journey, whether it's in the initial stageuswere O, try to define product, market Vin and you're kind of developingsomething, whether it's later, when you're trying to kind of appeal andacquire these customers, or even further later you're, really trying to doonly keep these guysom o Tu growthese customers. I think the importance of customers is paramouts right, treat,treat them like kangs and Queens and- and I think you know a happy customermeans a happy- happy happy, ofpeneer life yeah to Matchobol- I an I cansoent. So Iagree with what Teixo just say. On top of that, so probably not to eve too much inMinda, okay, I want to become a uniqe common. So if you fucus on Yon that atthe beginning, oee an you Willer, you will say: If it's your only objective,I will say what makes you so successful. Probably in the market, whatever wasthe organization and is a con debiity. So meeting shows thatevery people every single service ormanization they are all like Odebl for success andwhen everybody's working in the same direction, it's very important soSomthingi I was always asking the team was when you finish your chae in themorning or at night. You need to look at yourself in the Mr and ask Yoacontibute to the success of this...

...company Os this regon of this countryand and n Benes Yourself, because nobody is perfect and sometimes youhave some high and low. But if you know that you are, you are contributing. It.IXOLY is gin important and Lin to a Otivit n. You when you start a business and you build from theol experience is, is ther important tolead be example, so, lide most of the time respected, is a fight on thefinder with the team, especially at the beginning. So you will be respected byyour teams if you're able to helb them and not unnecessarily judging them. Atthe beginning of focusing on Kn, I saw so many mistakes because I'm doing alot of advising an all and wit wita, alsodescisions with certain companies, and sometimes we say yeah. We want toletally just use KEEPPI straight away and focus on you on that. But you needto Pul yourself ind. You need to gain the trust before beforteing that they areabsolutely key, but you need to use them at the at the right time. So beingthe leading, be example being in the field, you need to be really forlad forpeople. Wh are thinking about the statup experience. You need to be ready,Pascinatin because it's it's a very, very, very, very time consuming it'sthe best expience, but it's also Exclaimli a extremi difitunt to do so.Butt. If you AV this mindset of ACONTBT and Leadeshiideshi, be example. It'sit's more inful, okay, ithing! On my end, I would say, B andremain opportinistic. I know this word may have some negative comnucitationsin aen, tage or others, but I do think it's important stiy thrue to yourprinciples, your values and, as demetry said to your customers, but you'll be,should be in a position to seis market or technology of Portunities in animbler way, and that's kind of have that can have great impact. I mean inthe example of Drova, O Thousandy, twelve. Basically, our founders, wewrote the company really embracing the cloud and that yefind wher. The company is today neede becoming a UNICORNND and whatnot. Sofor the very long time we were the only company like this people was saying.Well, that's hard doesn't sound like it may work, but THA's. What, after andeven like, like thoid and apandemic. Now every business is going to thecloud looking to reduce cast. So I think this this. If you'R opetynistic, you're ov, youhave this mindset and you're ready to. If you see value, you're ready to teethose you'll keep on creating for Val Yueyeah. That makes sense. Therry meaning of Timistickis is an importanttoaneveny. FONA traning, a companyit is uniqcom to be sometimes when Youarereaning, a like en for people business you've got to you, God to keep goingnow. Hat's good. Did you anything toards yeah? I would, in addition tohiring we lent lesly optimistic people. I would also ask yourselves as afounder who do you want to be when you Perat and then determine what's the rightbusiness model and the right rats to market because nailing those two thingsare absolutely critical, and sometimes you have to try more than oneand see where the market is because it's one thing to know who yourcustomer is and to have a solution for them, it's another to figure out how toget to them, and that's where you know. I think a lot of mistakes are made istrying to always go direct or to try to go to large enterprise. Instead ofreally understanding that you're, a betteroom anmarket play Unsil, you canbuild out the feature set, or you know picking a the wrong type of channel ornot including distribution. I mean those are all really important elementsthat you have to establish early on and that's part of that product market fitis determining the right thert route to not get Sur. Okay, yeah, starting withthe end in mind, I'm realy a book about that. Actually, at the moment, theseven Ebits ofid effectiv people, so realy remaning upon that little bitmore so gays. We Gona turn to the a question in that shut. So let me openup the Shet to see what we've got in Therei'm. Gointo start from the bottom. Toth Ivou observe that becoming aUnicorn is appropriating the truegod OFA starter, that is to create newvalue that meaningfully change or customers, life apologies or physical phoof physicalfor fils of ECAL question. I think Ym Tru Gan have touched thatanthe very beginning. When I was asking you what's next Wen you get to uniq comWoa, I think so, don't know. Scane Chi, don't think it's aboutchanging a customer life things Wen ride, providing value for customers.You change their life in the process,...

...that's terrific! But I don't thinkanybody. You know we're not we're not forget what epill that they take that book hen thenYo see just in the series on it but yeah. I think, given the NA Trinic reavalue for a customer right and that could be cost reduction, it couldbasically maybe provide some type of compliance that coand help them managethings that are unmanageable, like Tor data, and I think that's the priority right,creating value, and I think you'll know it when you have it, because they'rewilling to pay money, yeah, good yeah. That makes sense. I now aquestion, maybe one for Youtibl, because we using your Timineginia. Howdo you identify risk taking sends raps and risk taking customers? Yeah ISO? It's a good. It's a goodquestion. Res Risticor says that so to the firstquestion is depending on what people want to doso, for example, if you it's a little bit like when you do risaking, when youbuy private pickiesor Shals in the markets or depending of your apitenceto the RIS Usto, those people, that e know that if they arrive earlyThewi te wil win bigger, they ate Beo risk of fiting bute. They can win BierD and You ave it's just going through interviewse. You can ask some specifiicar questions and some people they want, and you need to respect that o theywant to continu their lives, a the other pthings R, their life at Trisk. Ican acain speak about my own experience. It was very fun when you staff fromZheword catch noseeme, and you come from very largh companies before your way of Haing is changing basticn.So you need to be Pigat fol. That and some people are prekon for in themarket because they know that if they dose o Ig Trace in their career, theywill tey will dose that forcustomeres, it's mall you will find and it wasisyou on. The UK, as I said, it's also the case in knoledges, where you havesome peiple that want to show that the well the first one to use the technogyyea e. They are in Avetil. So at the beginning we were fufusing only ontechnology, techology, copens and one company will go and be your veryquickis one of the Sialang. I do in the UK very soon, and it was one of Owerlaest cistomer at the beginning, O the delivering food so and and for them they are exremelyexclaim tea focused on unnivation, the SHTA Pimatich, and they don't. They are not mescessary attached to thegess because they were born in the cloud. So we were. We focused on peoplethat were understanding us and they they decide. theyare very pliematic, TItesting. They are were tough, but Ewe were doing the right things and afterEse took Yor tetoms Te rist. So it's not it's not a situatrocg, but it'smore. When you have your technlogy, you need to see where the fit we go. First for people you will hire and customers. Okay, thank Ot. You Bot, I think, we'reprobably get into to to the Dr Mark Now. So I'm sure everybody is good to someofsom Osor business to our ten, which is very unfortunate, but I wantyou to sign two guys. So allthe Beteis Foro wor for coming on today and sharing your souts and insides it's.It was pretty good. So thank you very much for sharing. U Everything that WEUshall met you today and for the rest of the people and the ATTENDES Santuar so for training inand listening to US Gayes well make sure that we shoute the recording, Appropriatelis Fhrough, the usual majoron the social medium but yeah. Thank you again, everyone for coming to thenpartiipating to the Tedecussion, her I for as bi snthe. Thank you. operadics has redefined the meaning ofrevenue generation for technology companies worldwide, while thetraditional concepts of building and managing insize sales teams in househas existed for many years. Companies are struggling with the lack of focus,agility and scale required in today's fast and complex world of enterprisetechnology sales. Seeow operatics can help your company accelerate pipelineat operatics. Dot Net you've been listening to be to be revenueacceleration to ensure that you never miss an episode subscribe to the showin your favorite podcast player. Thank you so much for listening until nexttime.

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