B2B Revenue Acceleration
B2B Revenue Acceleration

Episode · 4 months ago

110: Ramping Up SDRs: The First 90 Days w/ Sam Nelson


It’s harder than ever to find talented Sales Development Reps (SDRs) - even hiring the finest talent doesn’t mean they will be successful if they don’t go through a well-structured onboarding and ramping process.

Their first 90 days will show you who will break and who will win.

In this episode, we interview Sam Nelson, SDR Leader at Outreach, about his unique and effective onboarding process for SDRs.

Join us as we discuss the advantages of grouping all your new SDRs together (known as the Agoge Tribe at Outreach), indicators of successful SDRs, what effects COVID has had on remote onboarding, and what to watch at one week, one month, and the first 90 days.

To hear this interview and many more like it, subscribe to The B2B Revenue Acceleration Podcast on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or our website.

Call. Reluctance can really hurt strs. So when you're if you are over stairs for the first ninety days,one of your major goals needs to be making sure that scrs do not getthe habit of being reluctant with the phone's you were listening to be to berevenue acceleration, a podcast dedicated to helping software executive stay on the cutting edgeof sales and marketing in their industry. Let's get into the show. Hi, welcome to be to be a revenue acceleration. My name is audion.With you and an ear today with son Nelson as Dr Le Dot outreach.How are you doing some today? Doing Great. Thank you for having meon. Yeah, I thought it was a pleasure. It was a pleasure. I was saying to you in the in the presentation, you're a bitof a celebrity. I think it must be the hair color that I alwaysremember your kind of is kind of coming from the first time I saw yourlinkedin pictures that the true things. I did, something that he's been photoshipping and I realized the true things that I like. It's really brave.I love it. I think. Well, thank you. Yes, I meanI did a long time ago, like just like as an incentive,and then everyone recognized you from blue hair now and stuck with the blue airfor the rest of my life. It's been several years. Are you joking? Whisky sent you. So someone in your team doing something or you doingsomething, and I was kind of a bad that you watst all. Wellwould so it was like yeah, so we had this new group of strscome and I said, Hey, if you beat the record for most opportunitiesset in a month, all I'll die my hair blue. And then theyended getting it and so that may have blood. So today some will betalking about ramping as Das you know. It's interesting topic and I'd like toknow if you think it is the same. Everybody's like how we covid still awe PUSS COVID is it? Does that infect right bobbies more difficult,etc. But before we get into the conversation, for the only few peoplethat don't know who you are or don't know who treach is as a company, would you mind just giving a quick introw to yourself and the company yourepresent? Outreach? Yeah, so my name is Sam Nelson and I've beenat that reach for quite a while I was in kind of one of thefirst groups of STR's, really early on. I was a CR for a year. I did well. As I see our stop strs stur manager andthe managers are managers for a while and now I spend most of many timedoing things like this and think I've worked with hundreds of different companies on theirboundst our strategy. So spend a lot of time in the kind of outboundsthe air world. Yeah, you know a little bit about the topic,which is wonderful. So some what we're getting from the market at the momentof what we hearing from from customizer, and we see it ourselves as well. It seemed like it's odd and able to find talented as D are Youknow, you've got to pay a lot of money. It's probably the theprofession for which the scenaria are increasing at the base of light at the moment. And even if you find someone, we've kind of a good truck recalledand you pay them a lot of money, you're not even sure that they wouldbe successful in Ya. And he's alition. So I think obviously theyoung boarding is really important. Who could you please share his all audience?How the young boarding process of ones a look like at outreach. Okay,so so the our on boarding process is actually canny unique and it's change withcovid. So I'll talk about kind of the path that we've taken and howwe're dusting it now for covid. But when I was a nest our manager, we actually did something kind of unique where we put all of the newstairs on one specific team and we called it the Egoji and we saw theidea from Sparta. So as Farta has like the egogi, where before peoplebecome official warriors, like all the New People are in one group, thetrained by people who are specialized in training new Sparta warriors and we're all togetherand then they graduate onto kind the EGOJI military. So we would do somethingsimilar on our team. So I was...

...over what we call the EGOJI.So all the new strs were on my team and so everyone was ramped thesame way and we got we got a few. There are few interesting benefitsto this. Number one was at this time in the world very few peopleunderstood our reach well and and I understood everyche weeks. I was one ofthe first stars that reach it, and so everyone could be try miss on. You kind of knew that firsthand. Also, we could train, Icould specialize in new SCR issues. So my whole world was, okay,how do I get stairs tramp as quickly as possible? Most stair managers havea few new stairs, a few kind of stairs have been there a whileand a few they're about to graduate and they all have completely different needs andthere's just no way you can give new SDRs enough attention, well kind ofgiving everyone else kind of attention that they need to. So by having allof the SCR new s airs on might, whom I could focus on new SDRissues and just handle that all at once. The other managers could handlekind of the more tenuedest our issues. So I could have the biggest teamin the company. But it's still just like dealing with new stre. It'sjust helping them get wrapped up. So and then it forced to get reallyget at ramp because I can focus purely on that. A great processes aroundit and it's stuck that. We still we have three agog teams now.We have one in London and the couple and one in the US. Wehave we have three Agogi bandagers and just worked really well. So one thing, though, is that with the egoji is really nice to kind of haveeveryone in person and then I could fill in the gaps as manager when I'mthere. With covid the egoji leaves have a little bit more of a challenge, right, because people are remote and you can't fill in the gaps orkind of proactively see things is easily. So it's changed a little bit,but we still have that same structure where the news chairs report to people whospecialize in those first three months. Okay, what's the difference between an e goodg Mana Joe and a Molt in your reps manager? Are you lookingat two defferends car set, or is it in the same people, butjust someone who's more, you know right, always new styleteles. What was thedifference between them? Yeah, so for a go g managers, ideallyyou want someone that's promoted from within, kind of knows how things work alreadyand they are top performer. So performed in the top ten percent. Ideally. Yeah, so you want someone who come in respects for the fact thatthey've done the job and they've done any propriety and they know eat inside out. But also, of the capacity of teaching those which is tough, becausesometimes the top performer can be a lone wolf that doesn't care about in theother people and themselves. But yeah, that can't that can be the case. But the great thing about top performers is that, especially like in thiscontext, is they've gone through knowing nothing to learning everything relatively recently, sothey understand kind of the issues of new scrs pretty well. It's very recentfor them and so they can know what's going to happen, what they're goingto be worried about, and we've we haven't had that big of a problemof like the stereotypical top performers going to be a lone wolf who doesn't careabout people. Typically they are top performers that want to be managers, thatare that actually really takes a coaching really well. I think there are definitelytop performers who can't see that, but I'm not sure that top performers areany less likely than other people to be able to learn the coach and ifthey can, they can be insanely really a top perform that ends up beinga good coach. They can make a huge difference. Yeah, that's massive, but we found a few. I think this is great for, youknow, organization like our treacher, even organization like us at Operatics, becausewe've got a critical mass office dyeah. We've got a lot of them.I think he's maybe a little bit more tricky when you have like three,four, five, you know as the...

...indifferent region. But one of thethings you mentioned at I love is promotion from within. We've been like sobig on that. They're literally apart from our finance team, one manager inour US operation and that's about it. and recruiting. But the but prettymuch recruitment is coming from within as well. The rest of Management Team, inmarketing, in cells, in every every aspect of the business has comefrom within and I think he's he's this creature creates a great cuchure because peoplecan move on and you have a lot of people at can be a verygood as Davidea, but the life span is nine months, ten months,because they just they've been good at it and it's like, you know what, that's the same. I'm star will, I just I'm just getting bought.Now I want to do something different and I want to get up theright it's so it's fantastic, but to get to fell that sort of promotionfrom him. Yeah, yeah, promotions from within or awesome. And Yeah, I mean it's not just the str side, like in nine months,they they did well as SCR like. We have a pretty good idea thatthey're likely going to be a successfully, like every SCR that's transition to ahas been successful, and so the a's are happy for them to come overas well the a manager. So it comes from both sides. Yeah,yeah, and so I'll only take fune I got G to become a spot. And what's kind of the the resorts so fast. So what do youknow? What are the resorts that you expect and what's the timeline? Alongstlike this, resorts Oul do you quantity fight and do all. I gog becomes puffing at the same time. It's only a few that make thespot and Tim you know, not like to one doo some kind of themotion that you've got behind that. Yeah, it's so. We set expectations atlike a year, like we expect you to be an stir for ayear. But the needs of the company, you know, whether or not wepromote someone has more to do with what we need at the company atthe time then, like whether in stre has been there for a year ornot. So like there's time during covid when there's a lot of uncertainty.We're talk performing SDRs have been there for a year and just like we weren'tsure how the s andb market was going to shake out, right, andso, just like things are on hold for a little bit. And somaybe it was a little longer at that time, or maybe we raise aton of money and we need to have tons of ease and we're going tolose like a, you know, like a fourth of our st our teambefore you. So it can vary, but we set expectation. We saytypically it's about a year, the subject to change depending on the needs thecompany. Okay, so it's a bout to your four. So when yousay becoming a spot, and does that mean becoming an a or does thatmean becoming like a celtified, I'll reach as dl just from Ko. Okay. So, so in the Agogi team, that's where scrs go on the firstthree months. Okay, suddenly, wonce, they graduate from the EGOGI. They will go into one of the segments. They might go into enterpriseor corporate right, or they might go into smb, okay, and willactually take enterprise from the EGOGI. Okay. And so we used to do itwhere it's like, okay, you're a goog then your smb, thenyou go corporate, then you go to enterprise. For the problem is bythe time they get to enterprise they've already been an str for like nine months. They want to be an AE and we need people in the enterprise tobe there for a longer period of time. So we kind of for ordained peopleto enterprise right out of the EGOGI and that's worked well for us.Okay, next perfect sense. So I would you structure is to see.So if it's three months on that down boarding, do you have a structureset, sixty ninety days plan? What do you expect them to date?Eva, what's up? Just smasure off success and and and what do youdo if you've got someone who's really struggling as well, you know it is, because it's that's that's what was important to one the song you've good todays, will just doing what and they can move on as great. But itwas a structural maybe the first questions was a structural to so t sixteen ninetydays. What would you expect from them? Okay, so the first well,Thir Thousand and sixteen ninety days,...

...we've got what? Okay, onereally important part of us. Thre thoty sixteen ninety days, is like thefirst week of boot camp. Yeah, and actually I would say like onyour St our team there, if you want to make changes, maybe thehighest return investment place is probably going to be in those first ninety days,first three months. Otherwise, if you don't get that part of the processfigured out, scur managers can spend their entire time fixing mess up doll swingsand not having time to even make sure if you want to have bad dollswings in the first place. Happens a lot is and it can be veryugly. Within the thirty sixteen ninety days, if we want to say go eighttwenty. On that too, I would say that first couple of weeksis particularly important. So they will come in and that's first couple of weeksand we will have a boot camp where we will give them. Will doa day on cold calling, will do a day on how sequences work andemails and things like that. We kind of give them a lot of informationand then, yeah, and then we will let them go and we takea very careful note of what the questions are. Right, we'll give thema lot of information. Not all of it will stick because they're brand new. Will take very be careful note of kind of issues that they run into, our questions that they have and see if we can refine are on boardingin the future based on what those questions are. So we'll do a bootcampwake and then we'll have they'll have trainings throughout this first three months. Theyget them on board and ready to go. Okay, and in some of thede actual objective. So it's that's interesting because you mentioned the old boundcutting. So do you have a big proportion? I would have expected yetoutreach. Also get a lot of marketing qualified needs, like people raising Guiansor eating your website or coming through a chat or whatever it is. Butwhat's the proportion in bound out bound? Are you saying that those guys justas the oppure the outbound people? Yeah, well, so we haven't divided intoinbounded out them. Sorr. Actually, I'm not going to be a guyon the inbound side. I don't work too much on that side ofthe House. But we do have like an inbound team specifically focused on invalids. So on the other hand side, Huh, you are outbounds. That'syour foot yeah, and I mean since I got to outreach, this wholetime I've been out bound focused and so, I mean I have some thoughts onit down but I'm more of a e more my expertise system outbound.So on the outbound side, yeah, we have strs have they've got afew camps and they prospect those. They will occasionally get an inbound lead andthey'll work that that way. But but you have an inbound team that thefocus is on this. Okay, and fallienst that up. Not Talking aboutthe outreach in particular, but you know, you say you've been elping a lotsof lots of people. What should be do? The quantifiable measure ofsuccess that you think people who are just ramping up a brand new team shouldexpect reate be number of meeting book, number of meeting set, number ofmeetings turning into an opportunity. You know, obviously all those things are important.Number of courts is important, number of activities important, people turning ontime in ther face and just not letting off to all is important as well. But what are the quantity thats if stuff and the Qualitas, I.Stuff that you would recommend for Adience to look for when that building that planand trying to put some numbers, because everybody wants to put numbers. Everythingis to be measurable. So yeah, okay. So we'll start with sowe work backward from how well are they tracking toward quota or like you know, we measure them on sales, accepted leads, kind of qualified opportunities held, they get accepted a pipeline. And so the first month typically there's nota huge correlation between, at least an average, between how well people doand their very first month, like the month that they arrive, and howthey're going to be a long term. There is much starter correlation between howthey perform and their second month and how they're going to do long term.So the first month we take it too...

...seriously. The second month it becomesmore important. Now what causes people to do well or not well when theystart out, and that the a couple of things. Number one is callreluctance. Can really hurt strs. So when you're if you are over stairsfor the first ninety days. One of your major goals needs to be makingsure that scrs do not get the habit of being reluctant with the phones.So we'll get them going on the funds right away and not afraid of thefunds right away, and that's one of th things you should have in thebud. Another thing is one trade of top performers tends to be how manyquestions they ask other people in their manager. Just like their willingness to ask questions, even it makes them look stupid. Is Relate's pretty tightly with how successfullyhas successful there, which was a little bit surprising to me, buthas been pretty consistent. Yeah, but in time of the number of so, let's say audience, probably most of the people who would listen to aconversation all be to be software type of organization. Okay, these the soundreally the people that we've got knowledge has how many sellers, excepted Leete?How many meetings would you say? Someone should the they should try to incentivizethat team to get in mounts one, two and street in that front.But the remember that we've got your autoparatics. What we expect from all your busis probably five meeting set in mounts Wan, eight meeting. And whenwe say months, why is post what you got? The boot camp ispuss like. You know, you've been trained. We did the theory andstuff. Is You actually when you go like was the clients? Okay,so there is a little bit of training before they got out with the clients. Of course there is probably a tow too strow expired before before they gotout with the clients. But we expect five, five, essay, andin months one, probably around the eight, seven to eighteen months to and andlet's say ten to twelve from months fly on one. That's kind ofthe productive stuff. So that the the deal. I'll bound. Do youhave semilar type of expectation from your team? Do you expect more? You expectlet's? Do you think it's a stupid way? The Way we doit? Is Not. He's not. He's not riven. Well, what'syour opinion on that? Now, yeah, and I was fretty similar. Right, I would say I think that's a good way to do it andthat kind of the numbers forever is going to be a little bit different dependingon on how you'll measure that. But yet typically it's some kind of proportionlike that and once they get to their fully ramped month, they need tobe ramped at that point. If they miss quota when we have kind oflike some quote relief at the very beginning, that can that can be kind ofa red flag, like hey, it's this or is there something thatwe're missing here? Is this not a good fit for this person? Wegot to get to the bottom of what's going on if they're missing during mostquote relief months. But yeah, typically it's pretty easy to identify early on. It's like there's color reluctance. Another actually a really common one during thefirst ninety days is just not reaching out to the right type of people.It sounds very basic, but that's maybe like the number one killer of stars, and a lot of managers just don't know that's the reason. And soit's important to look at like who they're sequencing, who they're putting their energyinto, and if someone's not doing well, there's a very good chance that they'resimply putting their energy into the round people. Yeah, make sense togo on calls if they're making efforts and they're just not being successful, andall that often comes down to that. Yeah, how do you measure corereluctance? That's something that I'd like to know. So because obviously I rememberbeing col reluctant and I think I was cor reluctant when I first started because, yeah, it was pretty covid and many moons ago and I picked upthe food for the first time. And it's funny because I was actually prospectingin French. We in an IT's full of English people. So, quitefrankly, they could not get a word of what I was saying. ButI remember feeling so self conscious of people listening to me and being able towander somed what I was saying and I felt more comfortable to go in theboard room. But you know, when...

...you've got when you're on bout twenties. The other they got up a boat from each to do a call,right, but I imagine I put myself in the shoes and, as Iwill grew up, I put myself in the shoes of the UK guy,right, the guys was sitting next to me. Is got like fifteen peoplebehind me. They all speak the same language and trust me, the environmentwas Letho, people were the bent or was big and people would just bouncefrom each other. You know, do some sort of a that's what makesthe life of Anasy are quate exciting and I think it's quite daunting because peoplelisten to you and you need to have a sudden level of confidence. Sohow do you measure that core reluctance? Not when people are working from whomyou stuff like cours going or you've you know, what's the I don't know. So what you are saying, I know that it's a big gap,but how do you actually get to measure it's yeah, so well, we'vetried to solve the problem in a few different ways. Probably what we willdo is we just out law fully automated sequences, especially the very beginning.Okay, because will happen at a lot of Companese is you can you canactually like get a few opportunities just from complete automation, especially in that firstmonth or in those first couple of months when you have some quota relief.So you can just totally automate and you're going to get lucky. You're goingto get a few meetings just from that. What can happen is a sjrs willsay, okay, I've fully automated, we've gotten. You know, I'vehit my quota doing this. I think I've found the solution to doingstir work without cold calling. And then what they find is, when theyget to be fully ramped, that they really have they have a really lowceiling on their potential. And so what we've done is we've just kind ofoutlawed fully automated sequences for new SDRs and it creates a forcing function for doingcalls, because if all they can use as a sequence that has calls included, then they have to make calls. They can't avoid it, and sothat ended up being our solution that we saw. We saw problems in thepast with people trying to rely purely on automation, but I say when Igo and talk to their companies, typically the problem is a serious just tryingto relive purely an animation. Yeah, I agree with you. I thinkwe've got any of all sorts of people seeing what the funny is not workinganymore, and I'd like to get your opinion on that, because I've gotmy opinion. But do you think the funny is not working anymore? Thephone? Yeah, people are. The medium funny is that? That's whyI need to do emails, emails, emails, emails, and it's calledreluctance personally. But what's your opinion? I mean, you know it hasn'treally went because like because of Covid or just because the Times of change.We added pre or prior to covid. I think you know. I thinkit's a mix of things with people think that they don't get a lot ofresponse from cold and and now I agree with one of the thingags you say. You said, well, if you back at the wrong three people won'trespond to you. Right, you're looking at the wrong door. People knowyou are they look at your company. You just introduce yourself five times througha voice, not that you send them on Linkedin. They got your tenemails. Yeah, you don't responded to you by now they probably don't wantto engage with your company. Don't take it personally. Move on to thenext one. But I think we've had a little bit more reluctance. AndI hate to use the term millionaire because I think it's just over use andstuff like that. But you know, even right now with my team,people send me text to ask me like very complex question that I would soonnecessary to the conversation could me. You want something, called me. Youknow I'm only I've got to move bile in front of you. Would youknow? Everybody can see it. Give you a bus? I don't know, but I get what's up and sometimes peoples some new skype and then thisin your what's up, and then send me an email exactly the same content, but they want a response. They could cut me. So I think, well, I guess what I'm saying in my opinion on it is thatpeople are more comfortable in sending message and even sometimes with friends it's easier tosend a message. They how are you those we speaking of different size isbeing away? We've not spoken. Are you doing? Let'stoke. You know, but I'd like to get your opinion.

Do you think the food as amedium is becoming less successful? Is it the same, you think?Is it? We need to use it in a different way. What's youropinion of the food as a medium to get proactive leads out, rich leadsfrom from new prospect yeah, it's interesting. I wondered how covid would affect thisright because so much change there. Whether it, like our phone calls, seldom work, you know, work better or not, and I've beensurprised and kind of how consistent stay, it's said, consistently successful, andI think part of the reason for that is, like, if we weregetting meetings over the phone, it was probably usually when it was with somebody'scell phone, like we have a lot of numbers, and it was ifwe're going to get meeting or some cell phone anyway, and so we stillhave that date, and so instended to keep working the way that they were. I do think that a lot of the stairs would like to believe thatthe cell the phone does not work anymore, as it's not necessarily people's favorite partof the job. Yeah, but it tends to and there's also sometimesa misunderstanding and like what success looks like in getting thirty people, because ifyou say, Oh, ninety percent of the time and not getting through toanyone at all, that's actually a very successful I mean if you can geta pick up ten percent of the time, yeah, a huge return investment,even the most of the time you're not getting through to anyone at all. So understanding that, just like a few connect a day, can makea massive difference. Yeah, it's really important. Now I agree with you. You know my opinion on that is really first of all, coming backto me when I was a youngest. Yeah, coming in and being alittle bit ashamed of myself because it's my first few goals. And back thenI don't have a sequence, sequence. Nobody gave me a sequence where intwo thousand and four I literally had a linked in the starting so I thinkI even have uro pages under on the desk and the foot and an exceledspreadsheet. That was about it. We see what as a crm and weactually put you get to put the CD ROM in the Tower of the computerto get it going on the computer. To give you an s the cloudwas as even there. But I think covie as alters in a way becausewe people walking from home and particularly for new starts. We've seen you startsbecoming much more productive and I think it's because they don't have that anxiety ofbeing listened to by the couligue when they're doing a call. And also,you know, one of the strongest power of doing the code is that youcan be with all you want to be behind that cal you know you canchange. You know you don't need to be the person you always your friends. You can change the intonation of your voice is and I was listening tosome of the stuff that you've done with the seves impact a getting me,and you speak about that. You can do whoever you want, you canput the mask you want, and I think this is the thing that peoplemean. Not Be comfortable doing an office full of his Daus, you know, in the bullpen, but they may bee. I've been happy to doit when the at home in the comfort of their own house, because nobody'slistening to them, right. So you don't have that Oh, are youlooking at me? Looking at what I'm doing? So I think get thathelped us and that tells peoples to be a bit more creative with the waythey are going and, you know, kind of create that mask, identity, you know, whatever it is that that works for them. Yeah,yeah, it's true, though, and you know, and sometimes this works. Actually want one thing on that is that one cool thing that I reachis when you put somebody into sequence, if they respond and they have theircell phone number in the Fudd it will put in the outreache for you andit is important to call when that happens because often that's day of the databasesdon't have and the conversion in others a super high. Absolutely ever reminded methat. Yeah, well, you've got to. You've got to also thegood old techniques, which is sending emails. was during sense giving or Christmas,sending a few emails like you put my emails. You get towards youout out of a visit to replay with the other other people, and themobile numb doesn't ever think. But that's that's a chail. Pretty we sellthe sales leaders like the secrets during dream...

...force. Yeah, the day wheneveryone was a dream for us and out of the office. How correctly,when you know you know a friend. You did that. Yeah, it'sa fund of mine as well. I told me that never would, neverwould that sort of stuff. But it looks like we getting to the endof the session. Today was a pleasure. I mean you great conversation. Iwant to thank you so much for your insight today. was great tohave you with us. If anyone wants to get in touch with you,I mean, yeah, if they can't find you, I would find thatvery, very, very surprising. But what's the best way to reach out? To use it linkedin emails. Well, I'll do you want people to reachout to youtubease or discuss with you or ought to discuss about outreach.And now could they use outreach to better that business? Yeah, I meanI'm on Linkedin same now. So linkedin by Sam Nelson Contentcom website is whereI post a lot of my post, a lout of my content. AndYeah, then if anyone's interested in in that reach are curious about can howthat it is or heard it, feel free to reach out to me.More than happy to talk about it. So good women. He sanks onceagain. Some it was an absolute pressure to have youngert for today. Great. Thank you so much. You've been listening. To be to be readthe new acceleration. To ensure that you never miss an episode, subscribe tothe show in your favorite podcast player. Thank you so much for listening.Until next time.

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